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fudd71 wrote: Does DC as a publisher have their $3.99 books unfairly judged to some degree by almost all comic fans?

I don't think so. When a $3.99 title has multiple features, a reader is paying for all of them regardless of if they want all of them. In such cases, you are paying more for something you don't want and people usually have a negative reaction to that. For titles at $3.99 that don't have a backup feature, the entire price you are paying is for the content you are expecting/wanting. Either you like the content are you don't but aren't left feeling like you paid for anything other than that main feature.

This is why we talked during the last Weekly comics Spotlight about the use of the backup feature in Batman to effectively extend the lead feature. Brilliant use of the backup and makes that extra dollar much more worthwhile than if the backup was some disconnected story.

JohnMayo wrote: When a $3.99 title has multiple features, a reader is paying for all of them regardless of if they want all of them. In such cases, you are paying more for something you don't want and people usually have a negative reaction to that. For titles at $3.99 that don't have a backup feature, the entire price you are paying is for the content you are expecting/wanting.

This is a completely valid point, and I agree as a customer you are paying for the full book and should judge your enjoyment of the full issue. I guess however it begs the question should they even try. If the vast majority of fans don’t like the backups and those same fans have shown a willingness to pay $3.99 by supporting the publishers that charge that, why even try. I guess the question is are people more likely to buy a title that is cheaper? While fans often say “I would buy that if weren’t $3.99”, is that really the case; or is this just an easier way of saying I didn’t like it that much. It is much like the “I’ll buy the trade” comment that many fans use, but never actually buy the trade.

This is more of a Mayo Report question, but do fans really support cheaper books, or support what they want regardless of price? DC could save money by not bothering to pay for the creation of backup features, and make more money by just charging more for a larger number of books. How much would that affect sales? I know personally I’m very conscious of price point, but that seems to put me in the minority of comic fans. I am lucky that for me this is purely a choice to support publishers that seem to want fans and I don’t have budgetary concerns. Do people with strict budgetary concerns buy more $2.99 books or simply buy fewer books cause the books they want are $3.99? I guess the question is really a business question; do publishers simply leave money on the table for no reason by pricing regular books at $2.99? Particularly those books that feature popular characters and would sell at a high level anyway?

fudd71 wrote:

JohnMayo wrote: When a $3.99 title has multiple features, a reader is paying for all of them regardless of if they want all of them. In such cases, you are paying more for something you don't want and people usually have a negative reaction to that. For titles at $3.99 that don't have a backup feature, the entire price you are paying is for the content you are expecting/wanting.

This is a completely valid point, and I agree as a customer you are paying for the full book and should judge your enjoyment of the full issue. I guess however it begs the question should they even try. If the vast majority of fans don’t like the backups and those same fans have shown a willingness to pay $3.99 by supporting the publishers that charge that, why even try. I guess the question is are people more likely to buy a title that is cheaper? While fans often say “I would buy that if weren’t $3.99”, is that really the case; or is this just an easier way of saying I didn’t like it that much. It is much like the “I’ll buy the trade” comment that many fans use, but never actually buy the trade.

For me, in the case of Threshold, I wouldn't buy the book even for $2.99 if it was a 20 page long "The Hunted" story.

If it was a 20-pager $2.99 book with the Larfleeze story I'd buy it in a moment & rate it 4/5.

I agree with John, it's whether I feel like I'm getting my money's worth.

I'm also willing to cut indie books some slack on a $3.99 price point because of their higher margins due to very small print runs.

For Marvel, they're just incorrigible. I actually do judge their $3.99 books more harshly, I have to REALLY like a Marvel book to pay $3.99 for it.

If DC charged $3.99 on more books, I'd get less DC books. Just like, right now, I get about half as many Marvels as DCs.

I have a couple of levels:
* Do I like this book enough to get it at ANY price? (If I dislike a book enough I won't get it even from a $1 bin)
* Do I dislike it at it's current price point, but I'd be happy to grab it out of a $1 bin?
* Do I like it at it's current price point? (An adjunct is, would I theoretically get this if it was $2.99 instead of $3.99)

Enjoyed the latest episode. My usual way to cheer up my Monday morning. I think with big 2 books on lesser known characters (Katanna) they really need something splashy. Presumably the character has some fans but likely not that many. I was only familiar with her from the Batman and the Outsiders book. I like the character but was not enough of a draw. They can also try well regarded creators, I was unfamilar with the artist but have fond memories of Ann Nocenti. However her return to Green Arrow was not to my tastes so she burned a little personal goodwill. So I think DC would have been better off making bolder choices with the artwork. Now a bold choice would turn people off but it is also going to get attention. Being a big two book, they have gotten past a big hurdle namely being in my comic shop (or front half of previews for those inclined). Ann Nocenti was enough of a draw for me to pick up the book in the shop and flip through it. It wasn't bad but it had no eye appeal, nothing stood out. Now if they had gone flashier, it would have stood out more. I still might not have bought it but with a character like Katanna (and that creative team) they need to take chances. I think Vibe having Johns on it probably will get more sales than some less popular writer.

Secret Avengers does seem more like movie Avengers which I don't personally need in comic book form. One thing I thought you guys might mention was I also thought that Colson's appeal was his ernestness, mixed with being a bit of a badass (from the movie and the Ultimate Spider-man cartoon). I thought this version was a little darker. I don't necessarily mind, but it seemed like the rest of the book was pushing for that movie feel (where Sam Jackson is the tricky manipulative one) so was surprised.

I stream from the site and it cut off right after Manhattan Projects. Not sure if it is my computer or not but wanted to let you guys know. I also download from iTunes but only once a week or so and I can't wait that long for the Comicbookpage. Thanks. Keep up the good work.

LA Rabbit wrote:One thing I thought you guys might mention was

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the whole "making a Sam Jackson Nick Fury for the 616" which just seemed like a what the heck? for me. The only justification was to pander to the movie version and it really lost me out of the story.

I consider that to be old news and it was something we discussed on the podcast back when it happened.

LA Rabbit wrote:I stream from the site and it cut off right after Manhattan Projects. Not sure if it is my computer or not but wanted to let you guys know. I also download from iTunes but only once a week or so and I can't wait that long for the Comicbookpage. Thanks. Keep up the good work.

Anybody else having this problem?

Also wanted to say that I agree on the space as a limited resource. I have been trying my hand at the ebay with limited success.

JohnMayo wrote: Anybody else having this problem?

Not for me.

My thoughts on the recent episode later

LA Rabbit wrote: Secret Avengers does seem more like movie Avengers which I don't personally need in comic book form. One thing I thought you guys might mention was

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

the whole "making a Sam Jackson Nick Fury for the 616" which just seemed like a what the heck? for me. The only justification was to pander to the movie version and it really lost me out of the story.

This happened a while ago, but has certainly been getting more pronounced of late.

I equate this to Cap donning a close replica of the movie costume at the end of Avengers #1 and Hawkeye losing the traditional costume/mask. Marvel is doing as much as they can to make the comics characters similar to their $1 billion dollar movie. Seems to make sense.....

I just finished listening to the latest episode and the discussion at the end about the Batman crossover being underwhelming. At this point can a Batman story make any significant changes or steer the series into another direction that has not already been told? We have seen two robins killed, different retelling of the origin story, key characters paralyzed, villians come and go, Batman killed, crippled, resurrected, etc. The latest change is the bat-family not trusting Batman. Is there really anywhere else we can go with this character? Too many books are telling too many similar stories to allow any major shake-up. Another dead robin who didn't fit the continunity does not seem to have the punch to make changes.

SpideySavestheDay wrote:I just finished listening to the latest episode and the discussion at the end about the Batman crossover being underwhelming. At this point can a Batman story make any significant changes or steer the series into another direction that has not already been told? We have seen two robins killed, different retelling of the origin story, key characters paralyzed, villians come and go, Batman killed, crippled, resurrected, etc. The latest change is the bat-family not trusting Batman. Is there really anywhere else we can go with this character? Too many books are telling too many similar stories to allow any major shake-up. Another dead robin who didn't fit the continunity does not seem to have the punch to make changes.

I think Marvel & DC both need to stop killing characters for at least a couple of years. Period.

They have both overdone this particular story device that it's totally bereft of any impact any more.

Both companies were able to, in the past, tell some pretty good stories for many years without killing characters on a regular basis.

Hey John, just letting ya know the new podcast is not showing up on the grid. It is there in the side-scroll (as just a black square) when you click on another episode, but not on the main page.

Perry wrote:Hey John, just letting ya know the new podcast is not showing up on the grid. It is there in the side-scroll (as just a black square) when you click on another episode, but not on the main page.

Thanks for the heads up. I'd apparently forgotten to upload the thumbnail image. It is fixed now. Normally I check that stuff the day morning the episode goes up but I apparently forgot to do that too yesterday...

JohnMayo wrote:
Thanks for the heads up. I'd apparently forgotten to upload the thumbnail image.

Well if the post time of the podcast is accurate, I can see how that may have slipped past.

Perry wrote:Well if the post time of the podcast is accurate, I can see how that may have slipped past.

I have a time delay on the episode release so they always go up at a set time.

Just listened to the latest show. Great discussion as always. I found your discussion regarding modern books and decompression interesting. It is one of my biggest pet peeves these days. I've found myself recently going back and reading alot of my books from the late 80's/early 90's and I'm so surprised how much I'm enjoying them. Even besides the nostalgia factor. I just feel I'm getting more story for the money. I'm not saying I'm against multi part stories. But I've always felt that stories should only be as long as they need to tell the story. I should rarely feel like I'm just killing time with an issue waiting for parts 5 and 6 where the action will likely take place.

This is one o the reasons I've noticed after almost 25 years of reading I'm fast losing interest in DC and Marvel as a whole. Too long, hyped for the news cycle books that just don't grab me anymore. Valiant, Image, ect are where my interesting is lying nowadays. That's not to say there are no books from DC or Marvel that I like. But for an example of how decompression can kill interest. DC recently announced the storyline "ZERO YEAR" that will take place in Snyder's Batman. Now Batman is my favourite superhero. I've really enjoyed Snyder's run so far. But an 11 part story to tell an origin story of a character we all frankly already know a lot about? Miller did a great job of doing that in just 4 issues. Do we really need 11 issues? And since it takes place in the past that means we will spend almost a year without the most popular Batbook dealing with the fallout of DOTF and what happened in Batman Inc?

While I still love this hobby we all share, with age I have patience I didn't have before. If a book is on the fence for me I have no problem waiting for sales and/or to wait until a story has concluded to see if it's worth my while.